Door staff reported after checks in Scotland

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Door staff reported after checks in Scotland

Postby Dave » 03 Feb 2009, 15:13

From the SIA

Door staff reported after checks in Scotland

Eight door staff have been reported for working illegally, following checks for SIA licences carried out in pubs and clubs in areas of Scotland on Friday 19th January.

SIA investigators and Lothian and Borders Police visited 18 venues in Livingston. Of the 44 door staff checked, 40 were working legally with valid SIA licences. However, four were found to be flouting the law by working without a licence and were reported to the procurator fiscal.

In Wishaw and Motherwell, Strathclyde Police and the SIA went to four premises where 16 door staff were checked. Four door staff in Wishaw found working illegally and they were also reported to the procurator fiscal for working without an SIA licence. The remaining 12 door staff held valid SIA licences.

Christy Hopkins, an SIA Head of Investigation said: "The law is quite clear; it is illegal to work without an SIA licence. In doing so, these operatives not only risk prosecution but put the public at risk."

Sergeant Ian Harkin from Strathclyde Police said: "The success of the operation demonstrates the benefits of working in partnership with the SIA. Strathclyde Police officers are committed to robustly enforcing this area of legislation. The safety of patrons attending licensed premises will continue to be a priority."
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Postby ballantyne78 » 03 Feb 2009, 15:48

I suggest that the statement about "putting the public at risk" is deliberately misleading, or to put it another way, bollocks. Not all unlicensed doorstaff are animals, idiots etc. I'd much rather have some of the lads I used to work with who now can't or won't get licensed than some of the muppets that we've had to put up with since the conception of the SIA.

As we all know, any idiot can pass an SIA approved door supervision course, not everyone can be any good at the job. I'd suggest anyone who's not too good at the job is far more of a liability.

My guess is that she's referring to the quality of training received by those of us who are SIA licensed. Anybody feel they're a better DS because of this training?
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Postby viking power » 03 Feb 2009, 16:11

Said it before and i'll say it now; These large multi agency efforts and the press release that follows are primarily media publicity events.

You want to enforce do it discreet without the bells and whistles.
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Postby Kieran » 03 Feb 2009, 20:41

Two constabularies between them checked 22 venues and 60 badges... what did they do for the rest of the evening? Every night at work I check between six and ten licenses without any help or Police backup, it takes me less than ten minutes.

And the gobbledigook spouted by those named in the press release would be amusing if it wasn't for the fact that the public at large might read it and believe it.
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Postby Gepard » 03 Feb 2009, 23:26

Is it not fair to say though that if they weren't making these announcements, everyone would be jumping up and down demanding why they weren't being enforced?
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Postby Boz » 03 Feb 2009, 23:29

But is it also not fair to say why do they not report positive stories?
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Postby Gepard » 03 Feb 2009, 23:32

Regarding license enforcement?

They do:
http://www.workingthedoors.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=18847

Or this one where they said there were areas that had 100%:

http://www.workingthedoors.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=20192
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Postby Boz » 03 Feb 2009, 23:37

Negative comments in the second one smart ass but one story in it's 5 year history.............. :roll:
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Postby Gepard » 03 Feb 2009, 23:55

First off, I wasn't being a smart ass if I was I would've finished it with something like a :roll:

Secondly, yes there are negative comments but look at the headline and the general tone of the article, overall it's positive, that DS are badged.

Thirdly, at which part does it become about license compliance by doorstaff and not license enforcement by the SIA. Even Littlewoman I think it was said most Ds in her area don't have licenses. I don't love the SIA, I could do without the 250 quid every three years expense but it sometimes seems like a damned if they do, damned if they don't scenario. These things are posted on their own website, it's not like they drag in all the worlds media everytime they do it.

I'm annoyed at the SIA that these 4 DS working without a badge didn't have the book thrown at them, and the venue shut down than the fact they chose to tell the public what they're spending they're money on.
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Postby viking power » 04 Feb 2009, 08:00

Gepard wrote:Is it not fair to say though that if they weren't making these announcements, everyone would be jumping up and down demanding why they weren't being enforced?


Gepard, If they go out and enforce word spreads through the industry, the lads and ladies will not work without a badge because you will get caught!.
I often compare it to speeding, we all tend to do it, we all know its wrong but we do it because the chances of being caught are weighed up and considered low so worth a chance, off we go. However, sit a marked traffic car behind someone and see if they speed then, the difference? you don't do it because YOU KNOW you will be caught.

Public announcements are for the media because their is 'no traffic car on the road', Enforcement is best when it takes place and it stands on it's own merits without bells and whistles.

They need these big campains because they simply are not out often enough to let the work on the ground speak for itself. I speak from first hand experience here, put men on the ground and get the job done works really well.

Look at the job spec when enforcement is number 7 on the list and they ask for suggestions as to how to go about it!
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