Resisting (Citizens?) Arrest

This section is to discuss anything related to the Security Industry

Moderators: Bulldog, Big Paul, karlbee, hippy, Door Bitch, Boz

Resisting (Citizens?) Arrest

Postby Gepard » 07 Aug 2008, 16:40

Hi,

Quick question, does resisting arrest apply to citizen's arrests or is it purely arrests made by the Police?

Cheers,
Gepard
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 3024
Joined: 17 Mar 2008, 21:27

Postby ESM Ltd » 07 Aug 2008, 16:49

Police
ESM Ltd
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 4688
Joined: 17 Oct 2007, 23:02

Postby Shiner69 » 07 Aug 2008, 17:00

Evo Training wrote:Police


Short & Sweet! :lol:
Shiner69
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 2146
Joined: 02 Aug 2007, 16:21
Location: Southeast

Postby djbt_uk » 07 Aug 2008, 22:46

The actual 'charge' is a crown-related thing.
You can however be assaulted by the person you are lawfully arresting... this should add some weight against your idiot in a court because they didn't come quietly.
"Semper In Faecibus, Sumus Sole Profundum Variat!"
- We're always in the s*it, its just the depth that varies!
djbt_uk
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 1101
Joined: 28 Apr 2007, 00:16
Location: Ye olde Lancashire

Postby manc_matt » 08 Aug 2008, 12:34

Evo Training wrote:Police

Quick answer but wrong. Who gave you that impression?

Resisting arrest, or assault with intent to resist arrest, as it is correctly referred to applies to arrests effected by anybody - that is a constable or member of the public. In either case the arrest has to be lawful, e.g. correct legislation used, notification given etc., otherwise the person has a statutory defence.

Just because a person doesn't appreciate that a member of the public has powers of arrest doesn't affect the position.
The views contained herein are my own and don't represent those of my current or past employer(s).
User avatar
manc_matt
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 1445
Joined: 18 Sep 2006, 00:29
Location: Manchester

Postby bigman77 » 08 Aug 2008, 16:32

Don't believe a citizens arrest exists, is it not any person arrest, I know I call it a citizens arrest lol but since we are nit-picking :P

Also yeah if someone resists when you try and detain them then this means they are using force on you which means you can self defend yourself using reasonable force to detain the person, :lol:
bigman77
WTD Head Door Supervisor
 
Posts: 961
Joined: 25 Jul 2007, 21:17

Postby black widow » 08 Aug 2008, 17:59

Any person can arrest anyone if they are in the process of, or have, committed an indictable offence. Only the police have the power to arrest someone who they believe is about to commit an indictable offence.
Resisting UNLAWFUL arrest is lawful (subject to use only of reasonable force) Unlawful arrest amounts to unlawful imprisonment. A police officer injuring persons in the process of an unlawful arrest may be personally liable for criminal assault and/or civil damages

The arrest must be lawful though, for it to be lawful you must say to someone I am arresting you because ...... and use force to physically detain them. You can only use such force as is reasonable and neccessary

S.24A P.A.C.E. Arrest without Warrant by Other Persons

A person other than a constable may arrest without a warrant:-

Anyone who is in the act of committing an INDICTABLE offence

Anyone whom he has reasonable grounds for suspecting to be committing an INDICTABLE offence……….

where an indictable offence has been committed, a person other than a constable may arrest without a warrant-

anyone who is guilty of the offence

anyone whom he has reasonable grounds for suspecting to be guilty of it….

BUT!

The power of summary arrest conferred is exercisable only if –

The person making it has reasonable grounds for believing that for any of the reasons mentioned (next slide) it is necessary to arrest the person in question, and

It appears to the person making the arrest that it is not reasonably practicable for a constable to make it instead

S.24A P.A.C.E. Arrest without Warrant by Other Persons

In order to prevent the person in question-

Causing physical injury to himself or any other person;
Suffering physical injury;
Causing loss of or damage to property; or
Making off before a constable can assume responsibility for him

Above info taken from my uni lecture, given by ex-senior police officer.

I'll double check my law books tonight on resisting arrest before I post the info up here, don't want to get it wrong and make a t**t of myself
:oops:
black widow
WTD Door Supervisor
 
Posts: 245
Joined: 29 Jul 2008, 18:07
Location: Wigan

Postby WOLF MASTER » 08 Aug 2008, 21:10

Just a quick one but I think you'll find you've quoted section 110 SOCAP not S24 Pace there.

Similiar but different.
What counts is not necessarily the size of the dog in the fight..... What counts is the size of the fight in the dog!

Making the Magic Happen
User avatar
WOLF MASTER
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 1019
Joined: 17 Feb 2005, 16:54
Location: LIVERPOOL

Postby manc_matt » 09 Aug 2008, 14:48

WOLF MASTER wrote:Just a quick one but I think you'll find you've quoted section 110 SOCAP not S24 Pace there.

Similiar but different.

He's quoted SOCAP which amends s24 PACE so what he's copied and pasted is correct - it supersedes the original rules of arrest. It's important for everybody to note that with the any person powers you are subordinate to a police officer.
The views contained herein are my own and don't represent those of my current or past employer(s).
User avatar
manc_matt
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 1445
Joined: 18 Sep 2006, 00:29
Location: Manchester

Postby Andy W » 09 Aug 2008, 16:12

Assault with intent to resist arrest, contrary to section 38 Offences Against the Person Act 1861

The offence is committed when a person assaults another person (not necessarily a police officer) with the intent to resist arrest or prevent the lawful apprehension/detention of himself/herself or another, for any offence.

It is an either way offence, which carries a maximum penalty on indictment of two years' imprisonment and/or an unlimited fine. Summarily, the maximum penalty is six months' imprisonment and/or a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum.

A charge contrary to section 38 may properly be used for assaults on persons other than police officers, for example store detectives (or DSs), who may be trying to apprehend or detain an offender.

Hope this helps.

ANDY W.
WTD Lobby Group Member
Andy W
FEDS Training
 
Posts: 1646
Joined: 05 Aug 2005, 10:33
Location: Nationwide

Postby pompeypara » 09 Aug 2008, 18:58

hacked
Last edited by pompeypara on 10 Dec 2008, 13:22, edited 1 time in total.
pompeypara
WTD Door Supervisor
 
Posts: 281
Joined: 19 May 2006, 02:32

Postby MH » 10 Aug 2008, 23:10

They just charge regular assault in reality though.
MH
The Guvnor
 
Posts: 1357
Joined: 13 Oct 2005, 11:29
Location: Berkshire

Postby black widow » 11 Aug 2008, 09:51

WOLF MASTER wrote:Just a quick one but I think you'll find you've quoted section 110 SOCAP not S24 Pace there.

Similiar but different.


To clear up confusion, when legislation is ammended they add an A after the section, so it was originally s24 PACE but, since it was ammended by SOCPA it became s24A PACE.

BTW Matt, its she not he!!! :lol:
black widow
WTD Door Supervisor
 
Posts: 245
Joined: 29 Jul 2008, 18:07
Location: Wigan

Postby black widow » 11 Aug 2008, 12:42

Right:-

A person who is being lawfully arrested, and who knows he is being arrested is not entitled to use reasonable force in order to resist or escape (Kenlin v Gardiner [1967] 2 QB 510, [1966] 3 All ER 931, DC) even if he believes that the arrest was unlawful because he thinks that the arrester is acting beyond his powers (Fennell [1971] 1 QB 428, [1970] 3 All ER 215, CA; Albert v Lavin [1982] AC 546, [1981] 3 All ER 878, HL)

Hope that helps!
black widow
WTD Door Supervisor
 
Posts: 245
Joined: 29 Jul 2008, 18:07
Location: Wigan

Postby dave_hedgehog » 18 Aug 2008, 13:55

Assault with intent to resist arrest s 38 OAPA and GBH with intent to resist arrest s18 OAPA can be committed if you resist arrest from anyone.

Police assault/ assault constable can be charged only if a constable is present although it can be charged if the assault is against someone assisting the constable such as security or door staff.

There are also similar specific offences of assaulting PCSOs, HATOs and other acreditied people.

As has been said the CPS will usually charge a straight Common assault or ABH in most cases to keep it simple for themselves and the courts. Also suspects and defence briefs have a thing about not wanting to go guilty to resist arrest/ assault police so usually go to trial and try to plea bargain for a straight assault or sec 4 POA so wasting the time of witnesses and the crown :x
Opinions are like lottery tickets, most of them are worthless.
dave_hedgehog
WTD Head Door Supervisor
 
Posts: 735
Joined: 17 Jan 2006, 15:08
Location: East Midlands

Next

Return to Security Related Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 1 guest